Avodah Zarah, Daf Lamed Bet, Part 2
Introduction
Today s section asks whether one can use these earthenware shards to support the legs of a bed?
איבעיא להו מהו לסמוך בהן כרעי המטה? רוצה בקיומו ע"י ד"א שרי או אסור
ת"ש דר"א ורבי יוחנן חד אסר וחד שרי והלכתא כמאן דאסר
The question was asked: May one use these shards as supports of the legs of a bed? If the Jew wants the object to exist for some other reason, is it permitted or forbidden?
Come and hear! R. Elazar and R. Yohanan: One said it is prohibited and the other said it is permitted. [And the halakhah follows the one who said it is prohibited.]
The Jew does not want to use the earthenware for the wine that is in it. He wants to use the shard only to even out the legs of the bed. In an abstract formulation, this is called one who wants the object (the shard) to exist for some reason other than the prohibited substance (the wine). Two amoraim argue over whether such a usage transgresses the prohibition of using Hadrianic earthenware.
מיתיבי הדרדורין והרוקבאות של עובדי כוכבים יין של ישראל כנוס בהן אסור בשתיה ומותר בהנאה העיד שמעון בן גודא לפני בנו של ר"ג על ר"ג ששתה ממנו בעכו ולא הודו לו
נודות של עובדי כוכבים רשב"ג אומר משום רבי יהושע בן קפוסאי אסור לעשות מהן שטיחין לחמור והא הכא דרוצה בקיומו ע"י דבר אחר וקתני דאסור
An objection was raised: Barrels or leather bottles belonging to non-Jews: Jewish wine kept in them is forbidden for drinking but permitted for deriving benefit. Shimon b. Gudda testified in the presence of R. Gamaliel’s son that R. Gamaliel drank of such wine in Acco, but they did not agree to this practice.
As to wine flasks belonging to non-Jews, R. Shimon b. Gamaliel says in the name of R. Joshua b. Kapusai that it is forbidden to make of them covers for a donkey.
But here there is an intention to preserve [the forbidden thing] for some other purpose and yet we are taught that it is forbidden!
The end of this baraita is a difficulty on the amora who said that as long as the Jew uses the object for some other purpose, besides benefiting from the wine in it, the act is permitted. In this case, the Jew wanted to use it only to cover his donkey. He did not care about the wine, and nevertheless it is prohibited.
וליטעמיך קנקנים של עובדי כוכבים ליתסרו למיזבן מאי שנא נודות ומ"ש קנקנים
But according to your reasoning then, it should also be prohibited to sell the earthenware flasks of non-Jews, for what difference is there between [leather] flasks and [earthenware] flasks?
The Talmud responds by taking note of a contradiction between the two halves of the baraita. The first half allows one to sell earthenware flasks belonging to non-Jews even though there is wine absorbed in the flask. Assumedly this is permitted because the Jew is benefiting from the flask and not the wine absorbed in it. The second half prohibits using the leather flask for any use whatsoever, even if the Jew does not care about the wine and wishes to use only the leather.
אמר רבא גזירה שמא יבקע נודו ויטלנו ויתפרנו על גבי נודו
Rava said: This is prohibited by decree lest his flask be split and he takes the flask of the non-Jew and patches it on his own.
Rava explains that in the second half of the baraita the issue is not directly deriving benefit from the leather flask with non-Jewish wine in it. If this were the only issue, the act would be permitted. The problem is that he might use this leather to close his own flask. Should he do so, he might come to mix his own wine with the non-Jewish wine, and this is prohibited. In contrast, there does not seem to be such fear when it comes to using Hadrianic earthenware to support the bed.
ולמ"ד רוצה בקיומו על ידי ד"א אסור מ"ש קנקנים דשרו?
אמר לך התם ליתיה לאיסוריה בעיניה הכא איתיה לאיסוריה בעיניה:
Now according to the one who holds that if he wishes to preserve [a forbidden thing] for some other purpose it is forbidden, why is the use of [earthenware] flasks allowed?
His answer might be: There, in that case the forbidden matter is not there in substance, whereas in the other cases the substance of the forbidden matter is there.
The Talmud now asks why one would allow the sale of earthenware flasks but not supporting a bed with the Hadrianic earthenware. The answer is that when it comes to the latter, they are so thoroughly saturated with wine that the prohibited substance is there. In contrast, the wine soaked into regular earthenware flasks is not really there. It is present in only trace amounts.