Avodah Zarah, Daf Samekh Daled, Part 3

 

Introduction

Today s section contains another question asked of the same rabbis when they gathered together. The topic is again relevant to idolatry and yayin nesekh.

 

הדור יתבי וקמבעיא להו דמי עבודת כוכבים ביד עובד כוכבים מהו? מי תופסת דמיה ביד עובד כוכבים או לא

 

They were again sitting together and they were asked: What is the rule with regard to the proceeds of an idol in the possession of an idolater?

Does the prohibition affect the money which is in the possession of an idolater or not?

 

If a Jew sells an idol the proceeds are prohibited. But what if a non-Jew sells an idol are the proceeds still prohibited?

 

אמר להו רב נחמן מסתברא דמי עבודת כוכבים ביד עובד כוכבים מותרין מדהנהו דאתו לקמיה דרבה בר אבוה. אמר להו זילו זבינו כל מה דאית לכו ותו איתגיירו

מ"ט משום דקסבר דמי עבודת כוכבים ביד עובד כוכבים מותרין

 

R. Nahman said to them: It seems reasonable that the proceeds from the sale of idol in the possession of an idolater are permitted. As can be seen from those who came before Rabbah b. Abbahu and he told them, Go and sell all your possessions and then come to be converted.

What was his reason? Was it not because he held that the proceeds of an

idol in the possession of an idolater are permitted!

 

R. Nahman says that such proceeds are permitted and proves this from a story of some non-Jews who come to convert in front of Rabbah b. Abbahu. The rabbi tells them to first sell of their possessions and then convert. Assumedly, their possessions include idols. So if they sell them first, then they can keep the proceeds. This proves that the proceeds of a sale of an idol by an idolater are permitted.

 

ודלמא שאני התם דכיון דדעתיה לאיגיורי ודאי בטלה

 

But perhaps it is different in that case, since his intention is to convert, they certainly annulled them.

 

The Talmud rejects this case as proof. These idolaters were intending to convert and therefore we can assume that they annulled their idols before selling them. But in a normal case, where the idolater is not converting, perhaps the proceeds would still be prohibited.

 

אלא מהכא ישראל שהיה נושה בעובד כוכבים מנה ומכר עבודת כוכבים והביא לו יין נסך והביא לו מותר אבל אם אמר לו המתן לי עד שאמכור עבודת כוכבים ואביא לך יין נסך ואביא לך אסור

 

Rather [there may be support] from the following: If an Israelite has a claim for a maneh against an idolater and the latter sold an idol and brought him the proceeds or yayin nesekh and brought him the proceeds, [the money] is permitted; but if [the idolater] said, Wait until I sell an idol and I will bring you the proceeds or yayin nesekh and I will bring you the proceeds, it is prohibited.

 

This baraita proves that the proceeds of the sale of an idol by an idolater are permitted. However the baraita does prohibit them under certain circumstances. Tomorrow s section will clarify what these circumstances are.